From Page to Nightmare: Dissecting 'Crescendo'| BLK Girl Reads Book Club Podcast Ep. 5

🕯️📖 Enter the realm of the unknown as we venture into the mesmerizing world of "Crescendo" in this electrifying episode of the Book Club Podcast! 🎉🎧

🌌 Brace yourself for a literary experience like no other, as "Crescendo" weaves a tapestry of darkness, intrigue, and unrelenting terror. It's a haunting tale that will leave you enthralled and chilled to the core.

🗣️📚 We can't wait to hear your spine-chilling reflections! Share your favorite passages, the moments that kept you awake at night, and the secrets you unraveled in "Crescendo" in the comments below. Let your voice join this haunting symphony!

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Transcript

Jann: 0:01

A man haunted by a family curse is taken beyond the limits of his sanity to a realm where he has no control over his actions or his fear. James Adams, lived a normal life in a New York suburb before the demons dwelling within him, awoke from their slumber to reveal unspeakable horror, and prophesize his future. His destiny. Crescendo is a novel about fate and the length we will travel to avoid the inevitable said in tranquil Rockland County, New York. This tale is suspense in horror will take its reader on an emotional rollercoaster of anger, anxiety, compassion, and fear. All right, welcome back to Book Club guys. So we're reviewing Crescendo. Welcome home. Death Awaits.

Joi: 0:52

Hi everybody. I'm Joy. That's Jan, and let's get it going. So, what did you think? What's your rating for this book?

Jann: 1:08

I will say this, um, I was a little worried'cause I felt like I was always middle of the road with a lot of my ratings and this is a very clear one star for me.

Joi: 1:18

No, it is it because it's a horror book.

Jann: 1:22

No, that's not it. It's not actually. So it's a one star for me and we'll get into like why it's a one star for me for sure. But, um, what's your rating? How'd you like it?

Joi: 1:34

Ah. I gave it a four. I gave it a four. I enjoyed it. I was interested. The only reason why it wasn't a five is'cause it seemed like a little, like I was a little confused. It got a little convoluted with the time jumps and the people jumps and I had to like make

Jann: 1:54

now.

Joi: 1:55

Oh, oh, okay. Okay. Okay. But go ahead, do your little, do your thing and then do your spoiler so I can go ahead and get into it.

Jann: 2:02

I like this. I feel like this is the first one where we're like very far apart, as far as liked it or did not like it because I did not like it. But, um, I feel like you, okay, nevermind. I didn't like give that you, so the difference I feel like is that you just said like, the only reason is not a five star and has some reasons. There's no world in which I would rate this a five star. So there's already a clear difference. Um, but before we jump into a lot of the discussion guys, as normal, we gave our ratings. We're going to be, doing spoilers from here on out, starting with Joy, doing a recap. So if you do not want to hear it, log off, read the book, and then log back on. I think it's very clear for my rating that I feel like it's not worth it. So

Joi: 2:51

Hey.

Jann: 2:51

that said, spoiler alert. All right, joy, go ahead and give a recap.

Joi: 2:57

All right, so we have James. Um, he is dealing with nightmares, night terrors actually. And, he's dreaming about Susan, his best friend's wife dying in a car accident where the car was on fire and he couldn't do anything to help her people pulled him back. Um, what's weird about the dreams is that every time he dreams this, it's like a weird, like, Like face to the person, um, to Susan specifically, and it wears him out. He wakes up and throughout the book, he's just getting more and more like into, how do I say this? Like, he gets, he loses mind a little bit more, throughout the book, so it's like getting worse and worse. throughout the book, you realize that he had an affair with his best friend's wife and he thinks he's gonna find peace in telling his best friend, basically, that after she died, you know, that he had an affair with her and the best friend's pissed off. So, um, the best friend Pete, he's trying to find a way to get him like, out of his life pretty much. And I think he's waiting for him to either kill himself'cause he sees how bad he's getting throughout the book or if he was gonna kill him. I don't know. But he thinks that because, James is gonna be out of the picture soon. He'll take the position of. Being with James' wife, what was her name? Andrea.

Jann: 4:33

Yeah.

Joi: 4:34

yeah. And, um, James dies

Jann: 4:45

All right. I mean, just skip over the whole book to the end. He dies.

Joi: 4:50

I'm so bad with recaps, but like, yeah, like that's like, it's, it goes, it's hard to follow if you don't read it. it's even hard to follow a little bit when you are reading it, which is why I gave it a four. Like, it was so interesting, but it was hard for me to follow, especially with the audio book too.

Jann: 5:07

I would say this, I think you'll get better at the recaps, but I also feel like it's interesting to hear your recaps because, um, We're going through these books like pretty quickly, and I feel like you've only done two so far, but I always catch something, your recap, where I'm like, that's not how I understood this. And for this part, I don't think he realized that he was having an affair. Like he knew the full time that he was having an affair. Uh, I feel like it was revealed to us, but like we realized that. Okay, gotcha. I was like,

Joi: 5:39

How would you not

Jann: 5:39

like going and saying like, oh, I can't believe I did this. Like, no, he went in like fully eyes open into doing that shady shit. Um,

Joi: 5:48

Yeah.

Jann: 5:49

so there's that. Um, now, yeah, that's exactly all I was gonna get into. That's normally our first question, and I'm just gonna go ahead and say that there were no likable characters. There were no likable characters. Like if I had to pick a favorite, it would be Andrea, but it's like literally by default there

Joi: 6:07

That's the

Jann: 6:07

was nothing about her personality that I actually like. Related to or liked. It's just she was the least detestable.

Joi: 6:15

I mean, she didn't do anything wrong, I don't think. I think she was just a wife not knowing what to do while her husband like spun out of control while also trying to keep to yourself that like, yeah, I know that he cheated on me, but he's also like going insane, so I'm not even gonna bring it up and I'm pregnant. Like at that point, like I understood because I'm just like, that is a shit position to be in. You know what I mean? But she's still trying to be there for him. She's pregnant, he's a cheater, and he's going crazy. Like, what do you do

Jann: 6:45

put her through a lot, but I feel like I still didn't get a lot of her like character. There wasn't anything there for me to like, I felt bad

Joi: 6:53

there at all. Yeah.

Jann: 6:56

but it wasn't like, oh yeah, this character is likable because of this. She was just in a shish situation,

Joi: 7:03

Like, to be fair, like I didn't even like put her on the map. I was so confused with the names. There was so many people going back and forth and the das name was James too, and they called him Jimmy and you know, so it's lots of stuff going on. So she didn't really blip my radar to like closer to the end, but

Jann: 7:17

your favorite character then? Is it Andrea as well?

Joi: 7:20

yeah, yeah, yeah. It's Andrea. So it's just, it's just one of those things where I'm just like, it sucks what she went through. And it sucks that she wasn't really like much of a character in the book, but once I realized what was happening and I knew what she, like, I figured out what she was going through. I was by her side the whole time and I felt bad that she was still falling for another asshole guy, which was Pete. You know, like they never said that she was like, you know, giving back the same affection or attention that he was trying to give to her.'cause she's going through this too with her husband. But I feel like Pete is manipulative enough and she's just very much like, meh. Or like traumatized by this, that she would just go with them, you know?

Jann: 8:01

was pretty much surrounded by creeps. Yeah.

Joi: 8:04

Nah, everyone is like,

Jann: 8:05

said I felt bad for her situation, but she didn't have enough of a character for me to actually say like, yeah, I like this about her.

Joi: 8:12

Yeah.

Jann: 8:12

So,

Joi: 8:14

You can even say the, um, the Aunt James's aunt that was killed was a pretty good character, but she was barely there too, so it was hard to say.

Jann: 8:24

yeah.

Joi: 8:24

Yeah.

Jann: 8:25

Well, who was your least favorite character?

Joi: 8:29

Honestly, I was going to say James, but I think Pete is my least favorite. Just because, like, I understand that you're pissed off that your best friend had an affair with your dead wife, but you killed your wife, so, and then you're like so horrible that you're like, Instead of just being like, okay, fine, you know, I've already killed my wife, or at least I got revenge on somebody. But you're also there to try to get back at James, who's you also see is losing his mind. His wife is suffering, but you're not even like, I feel so bad for his wife. I wanna be there for her. He is like, no, I'm going to be, take your position as this kid's dad. That baby's gonna call me daddy. You know what I mean? Like it's never for Andrea or the baby's sake is for his own selfish reasons that he wants to take up that role in their lives and he's just awful.

Jann: 9:21

It's so hard for me. Like I get what you're saying, and I feel like Pete was my least favorite character. It was just playing devil's advocate. At least Pete knew that he was a slime ball, you know, like, I feel like with James, he was just so self-centered and like completely un unaware of himself and like his, like even when he said, oh, I have, I think I can't live with the guilt anymore. I have to tell Pete, that was so selfish to tell him, first of all, and even if you're like trying to save your sanity, he didn't even give him time to say, okay, like, I, I slept with your wife. We had an affair. I'm so sorry. Like, what can I do to make it better? He immediately started ranting about how hard it is on him and how these dreams are affecting him. Like to the point that Pete had to, to punch him in the face while he was still talking about himself. And then when he started coming back around, like Pete's thinking, oh, I'm gonna like trigger him. He's gonna feel so bad. James was so freaking self absorbed that he didn't even consider. Oh, he might tell Andrea, like, it never even crossed his mind. He is like, oh, Pete's around.

Joi: 10:22

Mm-hmm.

Jann: 10:23

Like, so annoying. Oh, so

Joi: 10:26

I, I completely understand that, but I can't, like I said, James is right there. He's like number two of the people. I, I hate the, the most in this book. But, uh, it's just like the fact that Pete was, was murdering people, but he was in his right state of mind. James was murdering people. Person, but he was losing his mind. You know what I mean? Like he wasn't all there. So I feel like the worst person's, the person who's completely there, who's all there, who knows what's going on, who sees what's going on, just like I don't give a shit. Like I'm still like, I want my

Jann: 11:01

the thing too, like James murdered someone who had nothing to do with him. Pete murdered people who fucked him over. So

Joi: 11:10

That's true.

Jann: 11:10

it's not like he was murdering any, any innocent people. And I'm not saying it was right. I feel like he was so insecure, first of all, like, and I feel like you never, like the friend, you don't want around is that person. Like there was a whole passage of him talking about, like, when James told him about finding his dad and he kept trying to like egg him on and telling him more. I'm like, first of all, that's creepy. Which is the vibe for this whole book, by the way. It's creepy. Um, uh, but he was like, yeah, I meant it at the time that I would never tell anybody and I wouldn't use it against him, but now I'm gonna use it against him. Like, you never want that friend around who's like collecting dirt on you for when they wanna turn on you. That's always awful. Um,

Joi: 11:55

sure.

Jann: 11:56

which, okay, so this is a weird segue, but I, I just wanted to throw this out here too, since it's a horror book. Um, if you. If you don't know already. I don't like horror. Like I'm kind of a scaredy catt. I won't watch any scary movies. Like, and it's different with the like, well, not any scary movies. Like I'll watch like Halloween and like thrillers and slasher films. I'll watch those. But anything with demons, possessions, ghosts, I'm not for it. Um, but I did not get scary from this book. I got creepy. I got perverted, like on a scary scale of one to five. It's also a one.

Joi: 12:35

I got the chills, like I got like goosebumps when I was reading. I was like, Ooh, spooky. You know what I mean? Like, not necessarily like, ah, scary.

Jann: 12:45

yeah, the only time I got that vibe is when, um, he was looking at himself in the mirror and he was trapped in the mirror. I got that vibe then. But even then, I felt like, Every time the, every time I got to a part where I'm like, oh, this is kind of creepy. They dragged it on for so long that I was like, I'm no longer interested. I get it. He's trapped. He's in the mirror. I get it. Like, let's move on.

Joi: 13:10

I got the uncanny, I got the unsettling kind of vibes from it. Like, not necessarily like, you know, like it is spooky. And I did think it dragged on a little bit with the scarier scenes, especially when he was trapped in the mirror. Um, but. Yeah. I mean, I liked it for what it was. It was just wasn't like what I expected, per se.

Jann: 13:38

I will say one thing I do like is that it did give the feel of like slowly falling into insanity. Like you kind of felt like I kind of felt like I was losing my mind reading it. It could be because I didn't like it that much, but like, if that was intentional, good job on the writer because it, it did give that feel.

Joi: 14:02

That's another thing that I didn't like about Pete. Pete knew that he was losing his mind, and then he was like, by the way, they're looking into Susan's death again. So I don't know.

Jann: 14:12

say it as if it was like his whole. Agenda was to get him to kill himself. Like he knew that he had a history of it in his family. He was like monitoring him in college. he noticed when he was down and like losing time, even in college, he was like, it was starting all the way back then. All I have to do is give him a push. Like was his intent. It wasn't like, oh, I'm just gonna push him. And then, oh, I don't know what happened when he killed himself. Like he knew exactly what he was doing

Joi: 14:42

And I'm saying he was the worst.

Jann: 14:43

it with his chest.

Joi: 14:44

He was the worst. That's why, literally the worst. And that's before he was cheating with his wife.

Jann: 14:52

I'm not, I'm gonna, yeah. Okay.

Joi: 14:57

Like lemme just note that for later, just in case.

Jann: 15:00

Like I say, you never want that friend around. That's like collecting dirt on you for sure.

Joi: 15:05

I mean, I'm not saying that James was a good guy, like I'm glad he died at the end, but I feel like Pete should have got something too. Yeah, he, like

Jann: 15:14

I felt,

Joi: 15:15

innocent person for just checking in on somebody with your arguing on the street. Like

Jann: 15:21

but I wouldn't necessarily blame him for that. Like, um, like you said, it was insanity. Um, so I don't know. I, I, I guess I wouldn't, that's the whole thing too, like do you feel like it was actually a supernatural thing going on, or do you feel like it was just insanity? I.

Joi: 15:39

I feel like the insanity ran in his family and the insanity made him see these things. I feel like it was just like it is. It was kinda like a metaphor, like the insanity was like the family curse. Like this is gonna happen to you and it's gonna happen to your unborn daughter because it's a genetic thing that we lose our minds, to the point where we just kill ourselves'cause overwhelming. So I think that's what it mostly was.

Jann: 16:06

I agree. It was probably like a metaphor because when I was reading the book, I'm like, oh, like he's full on talking to these spirits and he's like seeing what happened in the past. So it has to be real. Um, but then, I mean, that's not necessarily saying that all of these things actually happened. It could have just been all of his mind and all the insanity. So.

Joi: 16:27

Like some of the things he knew, but then obviously some of the things he experienced and then other things he kind could've learned. Like when Pete and Susan goes through all the documents and see what he was looking at, he could've easily stumbled upon more letters or diaries or whatever of the rest of his family or his aunt. And that's how he knew the history and everything that happened before. And who's to say that he didn't go to a therapist before and go like, Hey, this is what happened to your father. You know, this is like, you know, it's a generational thing.

Jann: 16:54

could have been piecing it together. Yeah.

Joi: 16:56

yeah, and just the way that he was losing his mind,'cause he was, is probably just how he saw these visions is just like, To not let say, not humanize him, but to put a physical, like face to the insanity. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Personify it. So yeah, that's what I thought. Anyway. Just like it's not necessarily all these ghosts and everything that he's seeing, it is just the insanity taking over and that's what his mind is creating. Even if, like, when you are losing your mind, it makes, it tries to make sense of what's going on. You know what I mean? So that's, that's the way that I saw it. Yeah.

Jann: 17:36

Yeah, mental illness was a huge theme in this book, for sure. Um, and I thought it was interesting at the end, I don't remember if it was the epilogue or just the author's notes, um, but they were, they were pretty much saying, um,

Joi: 17:51

Hi.

Jann: 17:54

you wanted to make his debut. Uh, but they were pretty much saying like, what do you know about your family history? Like, how do you know that some of this doesn't run in your family? And that's like being haunted in itself, just living with that like fear that it could happen to you at any time.

Joi: 18:09

Well that's the thing too. Like I don't understand, like I know that Susan, no, Andrea tried to get him some help, but someone had to write off like, you know, he had to agree'cause he is an adult, you know, to get help. but I feel like at a certain point when certain things have gone too far, you can sign someone up. Like, hey, involuntary, like, put'em in there for seven, two hours. it's going insane. I'm afraid for my safety at this point, you know? Like, I don't, I'm not sure what you can do, but I'm sure there's something you can do, you know?

Jann: 18:43

agree with that, but at the same time, when is that point? They made a point to say that it happened so suddenly, it started off with nightmares, which you don't commit someone for, and then randomly he started seeing stuff. If you think about when he actually pushed her, that was the first time he saw stuff when he was awake. You know, it was actually a hallucination rather than a bad nightmare. She invited Pete over to talk to him about or just to make him feel better, you know, I know you're going through this, just so you know you have a support system. And then the very next time she invited Pete over, she was like, okay, this has turned into hallucinations, help me convince him to get help. And he didn't show up it happened very suddenly.

Joi: 19:25

I feel like too, think the point of doing it, I think my point of doing it is when you just like, Hey, I'm pregnant, Pete, can you come help me? Tell him, because I don't know how he'll react because he is losing his mind. I feel like that's the point, you know, if you can't even tell your husband that you're pregnant, I, I think that it could be because of this situation specifically. I

Jann: 19:45

don't get someone committed for that. If you try to get someone committed for that, they wouldn't listen. They'd say you, he has to sign off.

Joi: 19:51

no, I'm saying like I feel No, if you go to them and go like, listen, like he's having these night terrors, it's all happening so quickly. He's having night terrors, he's seeing things, he's erratic, he's not coming home. I don't know where he is. He's showing up at weird times of the day and night and it's unsafe and it's unhealthy and I feel like he needs help, you know? And even then I feel like someone would be like, okay, well at the very least you take your stuff and leave for at least a day or two and see what happens. See if he calms down, goes somewhere safe where he doesn't know maybe, not just stay in the house with him just in case he does something crazy.'cause didn't he choke her out at one point or something like that? Like he almost killed her at one point. Who he.

Jann: 20:34

was imagining it. He, when the night that she invited Pete over, he was like, I don't know what I'm gonna do if I go in, so I'm gonna leave. The most that had happened to her at that point is when he pushed her. He was freaked out and then she also admitted at the end that she kind of saw something, and that might also be like a metaphor, like she saw that he wasn't himself, but she said at the end like, I saw someone in there with him. So yeah,

Joi: 21:01

That's right.

Jann: 21:02

you get someone committed for that, right. Like that.

Joi: 21:06

Yes. That he saw that. Yeah.

Jann: 21:08

Mm-hmm.

Joi: 21:09

That was scary too. Like, oh my God, you just killed your wife. And he was like, just sitting on the lawn, you know? And even when she was like looking at him, just like staring, it's freezing out there, I'm gonna bring him a jacket. And then she stopped in her like, like something was telling her just to leave him like there by himself.

Jann: 21:25

No, that was, that was a different time

Joi: 21:28

This happened twice.

Jann: 21:30

that he was imagining killing her. Uh, it don't. He wasn't imagining killing her when he was just sitting outside the house. That's when he came back from the place the first time and he just noticed he was staring at the house like, oh, what am I doing here? and that's the same night, like that day she was like, okay, this is weird. Let me call Pete and we can convince him to sign off on this and get help. And that's the night he came home and was sitting in his car and imagine killing her and was like, I don't know what I'm gonna do. And then he left to where his grandmother died.

Joi: 22:00

Which is crazy'cause Where do they live in Connecticut? Is it Silver Spring? Maryland is far like, you know, I went to school in Woodbridge, Virginia, Woodbridge to Silver Spring, Maryland is a hot minute, like it is a nice drive. So I think, no, I think they were in New York somewhere, so they had to be driving back and forth at least four hours every single time they went there, which is nuts.

Jann: 22:29

It is nuts especially considering like the first time he was driving there he like just came to and was driving already crazy enough, but he was like, okay, I'm gonna turn around and then he was just there. Imagine driving somewhere that long and like you only came to once, you don't even know where you are

Joi: 22:47

Right? And it's traffic like, do you see traffic?

Jann: 22:50

know how you got back.

Joi: 22:52

Yeah. It's crazy. Dangerous. Ooh boy.

Jann: 22:58

Yeah. you did remind me when we were talking about the papers and shuffling, that part was also scary to me and we kept talking about the picture getting closer. Um, that that

Joi: 23:06

Oh, that was creepy when

Jann: 23:09

And then when he was like, he was just standing there and he was like, oh, it was nothing after all. And then she talked to him. I was like, burn it. burn it.

Joi: 23:20

That was so creepy, and it's like, oh, no, no, no. You saw me. I'm moving.

Jann: 23:24

Yeah. I'm here. It's me.

Joi: 23:29

No. Yeah, that was super creepy. I never like, um, movies that do that with the pictures. Something about pictures and staring at them just like I, it creeped me out with mirrors because ever since I've watched, um, I can't remember the name of the movie, but maybe, you know, it's a, maybe you don't know because it's a horror movie and basically the reflections of

Jann: 23:53

The others?

Joi: 23:54

People, that's what it was. The

Jann: 23:56

I don't know. The others was definitely a scary movie for me. But go ahead. I'm sorry.

Joi: 24:00

it was just basically, the mirrors, like whenever you see yourself reflected in it, it was like, I don't know if it was like a demon or a ghost or something, but it

Jann: 24:08

Peele movie, is it us or them or whatever?

Joi: 24:12

It's an older movie, like I saw it when we were like young, like 12, and it was just like at one point the reflection made the person drink bleach and they died.'cause they did it in the reflection. It was just, it was one of those things that's just nuts and mirrors creeped me out. Photos kind of creeped me out. So

Jann: 24:29

I just have a over hyper imagination, like you said that, and I was like, oh, so I'm covering up my mirrors. Like, I can't, like even the thought of something scary, I'm like, even if it's this scary, I can make it into this in my head. You know this. So,

Joi: 24:47

long enough. Yeah, especially when people say like mirrors or portals too, so don't stare at it too long or don't have it across your bed or something. I'm a total believer of that, so,

Jann: 24:58

I mean, sure, absolutely. Like why risk it? But I feel like the picture in itself is like just so creepy because I have pictures everywhere. Like if they decide to gang up on me, I'm done for, and I think that's the key right there with like supernatural stuff is like, they very rarely have a, this is how you defeat this thing and I need to know how to win at the end of the day, like I have a chance with a lot of slasher films and thrillers, um, I can fight, can't fight something that's not there.

Joi: 25:24

That. Okay. It's funny that you say that because that's how I got into monster stuff and thrillers and mysteries and ghosts. Kinda like, okay, worst case scenario, I have to go against a werewolf. How do I defeat it? And that's how I got into all this scary stuff.

Jann: 25:40

So then you watch a bunch of stuff that you can't defeat.

Joi: 25:44

You, you can defeat most things if you mostly, if you're melanated and you got some of'em, some

Jann: 25:51

you can avoid most things, but I already know to avoid most things. I don't need to scare myself to do that.

Joi: 25:58

That's the thing, avoidance is key and it's mostly like these are life lessons. Young black girl, don't play with Ouija boys, you know, don't go with their shop and get some random old ass doll. Like avoidance is key

Jann: 26:15

why wouldn't you? Like you already know to avoid that stuff though. Why do you need to watch movie after movie to know it?

Joi: 26:22

just in case. You never know. Just like you, I have the, um, I don't know if you can see it, I can't see it, um, behind on my packing boxes, but I have the American Association something medical book. I'm like, I told, Earl, I said, I need this just in case the world collapses. At least we know how to heal ourselves in case someone gets sick or, you know, anything happens with like stitches or it is like a

Jann: 26:49

a lot of those kind of books too,

Joi: 26:51

yeah.

Jann: 26:51

plants that Heal and How to survive, like while foraging and like a lot of survival list books. Okay. Yeah, me

Joi: 26:59

yeah. But this was just like a pure like medical book, you know, just in case. And now I think about it. If the world could collapsed, why wouldn't I just go to like a. Book Ilion or Barnes and Noble and just like loot the books I need like, like, Hey Jan, you broke your arm. Let's go. I'm gonna go get a book from the, obviously Abandoned Barnes and Noble to see how to make a splint.

Jann: 27:26

I feel like a lot of, like, the reason why we're safe in society today is because we have so much infrastructure that keeps us safe. Traveling from books to Noble or like any kind of bookstore for me, 10 minutes in a car if we don't have gas and things, I'm not driving to get a book.

Joi: 27:44

It's

Jann: 27:44

I mean, I probably will, but, you know, uh, resources are finite at that point and traveling in itself is dangerous'cause you never know what or who you're gonna run into. There's no loss that keep you safe. Uh, so yeah, it's a risk going out to get a book after the apocalypse. So yeah, that would be the reason.

Joi: 28:01

It'd be a whole episode of Walking Dead who never did a supply run. That was an episode.

Jann: 28:07

That was a whole story arc.

Joi: 28:10

Right.

Jann: 28:11

season they're gone.

Joi: 28:14

And you're sitting here with a broken arm, like, I hope she comes back I don't know.

Jann: 28:18

My broken arm can lead to her broken neck. You never know.

Joi: 28:22

Whoa. Off topic. Back to the book.

Jann: 28:27

Okay, so here's a question that I have since we're talking about this. This book was written by a black woman. I do not feel like the characters were black.

Joi: 28:40

Okay.

Jann: 28:40

Like I'm very curious to like see your opinion on that. Like I don't think this is a book about black people.

Joi: 28:46

Okay. I had to. Remember we talked about that TikTok when the girl was like, oh, she had long blonde hair. Oh, she had a sewing girl. She was looking good. I got a lot of that. I checked to make sure I was listening to the right book, like three different times on our list. I was like, this is the right author, right? Like, I'm sure yeah, this is the right author. So then, um, I tried to like listen out for like little tidbits here and there, and the only thing that stood out to me was when James noted that an Andrea had like, olive skin or something, like she did something with her olive skin.

Jann: 29:24

That's what I was gonna say. The wives at most were black because they talked about Andrea's, olive skin, and they also, Pete mentioned that, this is the only indicator that I had. Pete mentioned that when Susan died, the only thing that he kept,'cause you know, he got rid of all the knick knickknacks, was her silk pillowcase. And I was like, oh, so she's black. Got it.

Joi: 29:46

Yeah,

Jann: 29:47

And I mean, that's, that's a reach in itself, but that's, that's the only indicator that I got.

Joi: 29:53

Yeah. I mean like, and when it comes to James, like the name kind of, and his dad being called Jimmy and his, his name also being James and people wanted to call him Jimmy. I feel like a lot of like black people aren't named like James and their nickname is Jimmy. I mean, just personal experience, you know, and same thing

Jann: 30:11

was just,

Joi: 30:12

just like,

Jann: 30:13

yeah, same. Yeah, it, it's the names, but it's also just like the way they navigated the scary stuff. Like there's no way Pete, being a black person is gonna be like, oh no, I'll just go in. Call the like call, that's the only time you call the police is when some supernatural stuff. Like no, they can take care of it. We're good. Like, I'm not going in there by myself. Um, or even in the nightmares where he was standing outside the house, this is James at this point, he was like, well, I guess it won't end until I go in. And I was like, you've been standing here for five seconds. I feel like you can give it a better try than that. Like, what do you mean just go in? Like, I think they want me to go in, so I just, what? I don't care what they want. Are you kidding me?

Joi: 31:01

I think we're on the same page. As far as the Wises. I knew Andrea's Black, and that's why when they say Andrea, I was like, no, her name's Andrea and know for sure that's

Jann: 31:12

caught Drea half the time anyway.

Joi: 31:15

Susan, I'm not too sure about either, but like you said, the pillowcase makes sense, so who knows,

Jann: 31:24

Yeah, and I think he even said that, the pillowcase selt like olive oil or something, and I was like, oh, she's, she's blackety black.

Joi: 31:34

right?

Jann: 31:38

Um, but yeah, that's just how I, I felt like the whole time I was reading like, oh,

Joi: 31:43

It's interesting though,

Jann: 31:44

I guess.

Joi: 31:45

Like all the books that I read so far written by black women, they all have been very much like, this is a black story. This is black people going through, like navigating through this, you know? And th this wasn't it at all. Just very subtle hints, you know? And I'd be really interested to see what she said about, says about that as well.'cause it is not like a big thing. We were like, okay, well it's a black author, we're gonna read the book. But we never said like,'cause we just kind of assumed too that most of the books were be representing black people. So maybe she just read about white characters this time.

Jann: 32:24

and to be completely honest, like I don't mind, right. Reading and reviewing books about, I mean, by white authors as well, but I just don't think I wanna start with that, with the podcast, no problem with reviewing some of those books too. I feel like our voice in analyzing it is enough of a black perspective to like, have it qualified, but yeah, to your point, like this is the first time, um, not the first time because, you know, there were, it's not like it was only black characters in any of the other

Joi: 32:53

Nichols, drew Nichols.

Jann: 33:03

I'm so mad that you just like, I'm in shock over here. Like, does she really? You're a whole villain now. Speaking of villain, I don't know if I told you yet, but Jolie and I watched a movie called Do Revenge the other day. it's either on Prime or Netflix or something, but it's so good and I was hating on it the whole time, but I liked it, huh?

Joi: 33:27

Do revenge,

Jann: 33:29

Yes. Do revenge.

Joi: 33:31

huh? I never heard of that.

Jann: 33:34

It's a do movie, but you know, if you have time to watch it, I would suggest it. I recommend it. It was funny. Um, yeah, so it's interesting'cause I really wanna get your opinion on this. just overall looking at the book, again, I don't do horror books, so I don't really have much to compare it to I said I like give ratings based on like the genre. I would probably recommend Skin of the Sea before I recommend the wedding date. But as far as the romance goes, I feel like it's doing better on the scale compared to other romances than Skin of the Sea was compared to my other fantasies. I don't have anything to compare this to. Like the closest I've gotten to reading a horror book was Chamber of Secrets. Like I was terrified as a teenager reading that book. I mean like tears in my eyes. Let me go sleep with mom tonight. Kind of scared once the Basalis, and it was before we knew it was a snake, but when he started, hearing the whispering in the hallways, I was like, Uhuh. He said, I hear too many noises at night already. Let me just go sleep with my mom.

Joi: 34:41

I never realized that your fear was that bad before, and I feel kind of bad that we're having a horror month.

Jann: 34:52

Well, luckily this was not a scary book in my opinion, but, um, I just don't have a lot to compare it to and it's very interesting to me that I would rate it like a one star. because I feel like the, the interesting thing about this was the affair. Like I wasn't that interested in all the very like gratuitous things about him, like looking in the mirror at himself and spinning a chapter on that alone. But it also won the Brahm Stoker award for, it's like a horror, award that authors can get so, or horror genre award for authors and novels. So apparently I'm in the minority by not liking it and I'm very happy for her that she won an award. But there,

Joi: 35:40

For me, knowing, like reading quite a few, like horror novels and thriller novels, like I said, gave me the heebie-jeebies. I wasn't necessarily like, I gotta sleep with the lights on. I actually just listened to the book, when I was sitting in the dark with my pet sleeping, and play my switch.

Jann: 36:01

at night at all,

Joi: 36:03

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. And that's the thing, I was home alone too.'cause you know, Earl works until 11 at night. But, I was like, oh, goosebumps. But I didn't think it was too scary. Um, I wouldn't write it a one, I would give it a three because it was creepy. Like every once in a while, my glance to my door, glance to the mirror, like there's no bitches right there. Right. Especially during those scenes, and because of the background that I sit, like I'm already afraid of mirrors and advanced darkness, like SpongeBob. This is advanced darkness,

Jann: 36:38

You are so ridiculous.

Joi: 36:40

but no. Yeah, I can see the creepiness factor. I, I liked it. I like where it's at.

Jann: 36:45

I, the scariest thing for me was like how many perverts it seemed to be in the world because I'm, I'm, this is like beating around the bush and it's like too much beating around the bush. But it was weird and like sexual a lot of the times that we're not like like him watching his father masturbate to his grandmother, thinking it was his aunt.

Joi: 37:07

Yeah.

Jann: 37:08

why am I reading this? What am I reading right now? Like, what is this?

Joi: 37:15

I

Jann: 37:15

What level of hell?

Joi: 37:19

I wanted those kind of sexes in the wedding date. This is what I was asking for, like, let's vice versa, like you can like skip over this part and that book and like, put this into the wedding date.

Jann: 37:31

the whole time, like especially at the beginning where he was like talking about having sex with a woman, but then he turned into the woman and then he was choking her and I was like, did he kill Susan by like sexual assault? What happened? I still don't really understand what happened there,

Joi: 37:50

I don't either, because at first he was like, yeah, I'm the guy. And it's like, yeah, my nipples like on my breast. And I was like,

Jann: 37:58

Well, when she said breasts at first, I'm like, that's an interesting way to describe like a man.

Joi: 38:03

Yeah.

Jann: 38:04

And then as I was like, oh, okay, he's a woman now.

Joi: 38:07

Yeah.

Jann: 38:08

Um, but that was like the least creepy esteem for me, weirdly enough because like the rest was people getting off to dead bodies and family members.

Joi: 38:21

Ooh. You know, another creepy one was when the dead grandmother was looking at him in the doorway watching her, and like she was looking at him like, coming towards him. That was creepy. I was like, Ooh, get out of there. Like, I don't understand why he never moved away. You know what I mean? Just standing there, like, I'm like, that's the thing, like a lot of this, book too, it was kind of funny because the way my mind works, I wanna turn things into a funny situation when I get too scared. So, um, when the part,

Jann: 38:56

I don't have that gene. Maybe that's the difference between us. Like when I get scared, I immediately get pissed that I'm scared.

Joi: 39:04

I'm so angry. I'm that, I'm scared now. What's that? Ghosting on punch in the face.

Jann: 39:10

a defense mechanism. I turn into fight like immediately. But Sorry. Go ahead.

Joi: 39:17

I definitely go down the route of black people laughing at inappropriate things when they should be like doing something else. But I was thinking like the whole time in the reflection, um, when he was in the shower and it was like him, but not him, but it was somebody else. And I imagine him going like, that can't be me. His dick's too big.

Jann: 39:41

That's messed up. Didn't he say something like that though? Like I swear every sexual scene they had in there was like to make you feel uncomfortable. And I feel like thinking about it, and this is, I like took myself out of the scene because it just made me that uncomfortable and I was like, this must be intentional to like, you know what? It gave me vibes of, do you remember the episode of the office, the Halloween episode where Gabe made that movie and it was just a bunch of creepy scenes to make you feel unsettled? That's what this book reminded me of. A lot of this doesn't even make sense, especially in the beginning where he just kept waking up. It was chapter 10, I checked it was chapter 10 before I even realized that it was the same person through all of these scenes. Like I'm sitting here like, when are we gonna get to the story? That's what I'm here for is a plots not just uncomfortable scene after uncomfortable scene.

Joi: 40:35

That's exactly, you hit the nail on the head.'cause I said it was like uncanny. It was uncomfortable. It gave me like the heebie-jeebies listening to it.

Jann: 40:44

Like the first, the first scene. Yeah, the first scene. I was like, oh, that's creepy. And I actually turned it off, like it might be too creepy. And like the next day I went to go listen to it and I was like, oh, another kind of creepy scene by chapter three. I was like, what's happening? Like, come on. And then by chapter 10, when we actually finally started getting to the pot, I was just annoyed, like, I can't believe. And I was so excited to put it on the list.'cause I'm like, I don't like horror books. I'm really gonna scare the shit on myself with this one because it won the Brahm Stalker award. Um, and then I wasn't scared. I was just like,

Joi: 41:22

Yeah.

Jann: 41:22

get it. I don't get it. And I, and I know I'm not the target audience, so I'm just gonna let it be that, but yeah.

Joi: 41:29

the thing, like being a horror enthusiast, you have to know your genre, you have to know your authors because there's been more, like, let's say I've read like 30 books so far, that's horror. You know? I would say at least half of them have either fallen flat or I'm just like bored. You know? You have to find the right kind of writer and the right kind of story. Because more than that won't work for you. It's the same thing with fantasy, same thing with romantic. Like some things work, some things don't, and then you find like who you like, you know?

Jann: 42:06

That's fair. I just feel like I read so many romance and fantasy novels in my life that I like can immediately pick it up and know what trope it's gonna be. And I compare it to others and see how I feel about it. And like sometimes I can lose myself in the story, with horror and I'm just saying this to give her credit. Either I'm too afraid to finish or I finish it. And I was like, well that was stupid because I didn't wanna read it in the first place. So that's why I don't read them, you know.

Joi: 42:30

And that's another thing.'cause horror has so many different, like, like you say, you can pick up a re or romantic book. Like, okay, I see where this is going pretty easily. You know? I feel like with horror, there's body horror, there's ghosts, there's demons, there's mindset. You know what I mean? There's so many different ways you can go and there's so many ways you can mess it up, you know? So, That's the way I look at it anyway.'cause I don't, I don't like, like body horror at all. I don't wa I never watch saw, um, I've never,

Jann: 42:59

like gory things?

Joi: 43:00

yeah, gory body, like anything like that. Like if it's mutilation of someone's body, past factors with them just getting killed,

Jann: 43:08

Like where where is the because I feel like with some slasher film, sometimes they go

43:11

with the shock factor.

Jann: 43:13

So is that too much for you or is it like the saw movies? Like how did you feel about, um, the purge

Joi: 43:23

I don't mind the purge, you know? Um, I can

Jann: 43:26

final destination?

Joi: 43:28

I can watch it, but when it gets too gross, I close my eyes because the way that my brain is set up, I'll constantly see just that, that moment over and over again. And I just, I can't do it. And I can feel it. Like, if someone has like a needle slowing slowly going through someone's eye, If that's the whole movie, it's just constant, like body stuff like that. I can't do it, but if it's just like this one scene, this guy is getting killed horribly with a needle in his eye and it's going for a while, I'm like, babe, just just tell me when it's over. Like just, lemme know. It's over, you know?

Jann: 43:59

So like any movie's directed by Gabe, not your thing?

Joi: 44:02

Yeah. Basically.

Jann: 44:07

That's

Joi: 44:07

So, yeah. Yeah.

Jann: 44:10

Uh, yeah. That's how I felt. Like, I felt like they tried or she tried to create horror through a mood of Just making you uncomfortable, but mostly I feel like it was hard to follow. It got too lengthy at times and um, yeah, I did not appreciate, like the weird sex scenes

Joi: 44:29

And the sex scenes

Jann: 44:30

have did without

Joi: 44:30

with the the voice actor.'cause it was all breathing hard. Oh yeah. And her breast, it was so delicious. That voice actor freaked me out on those sex scenes. I'm like,

Jann: 44:43

It freaks me out with most things. And I feel like the first like weird sex scene they had was when they were talking about the girl's body on the sidewalk and he said that he was getting excited looking at it. And I was like, wait, what? And little did I know that was just the tip of the freaking iceberg. So

Joi: 45:01

Oh my gosh.

Jann: 45:01

appreciate it.

Joi: 45:02

one more scary part before we move on. When Pete said he looked at the house and the house was like, go away. And he was like, what did I just see that? And then he looked away and he looked back over and it was like over him like this. I kind of freaked out, like, what the hell?

Jann: 45:17

I didn't think I actually laughed during that. It gave me like Monster house vibes,

Joi: 45:21

It gave me

Jann: 45:22

which was a great

Joi: 45:23

too, but it, it was also kind of creepy.

Jann: 45:27

Yeah. It just made me wanna watch Monster House.

Joi: 45:31

That was a good movie, so

Jann: 45:32

I was not creeped out at all, but it did lend, itself to the fact that, yeah, they were not black characters because if a house told me to go away, I'd keep driving

Joi: 45:43

I'll have to tell

Jann: 45:44

and I'd call the police and say, yeah.

Joi: 45:51

no, I'll just

Jann: 45:52

be fair, Andrea didn't hear all that. She said she felt like creeped out, but I feel like if the black girl had heard that, she would've been like, oh yeah, let's go to the police station,

Joi: 46:01

Yeah.

Jann: 46:02

like.

Joi: 46:02

To be honest, if I was Pete, I feel like the better case scenario is not to go try to find him. I would try to tell her like, listen, he went through all these papers, he left them out. He's obviously coming home in the morning. Let's wait here for him. It's better that way. You know, we don't know if he's doing something like dangerous. I don't want us to follow him, especially in your condition. Let's just hang out here. Let's wait up for him. And especially if you know he's gonna kill himself, you just like, like done and done. I'm not driving four and a half hours to go to a haunted house.

Jann: 46:34

But I mean, to be fair, if you're thinking about being like the kind of sociopath that Pete is, he's trying to earn as many brownie points as he can. So him going out of his way to drive hours is gonna earn a lot more brownie points. especially if they find him dead. rather than him convincing her to not go and then he ends up dead, like in that case, she might blame him rather than be thankful to him. And he's a sociopath. So

Joi: 46:56

It, it gave me creeper vibes too,'cause like kind of,

Jann: 46:59

a psychopath,

Joi: 47:00

he gave me very much like the nice guy vibes. Like, I'm such a nice guy, you know, let me do this, lemme do that. But he's acting like fucking nuts, you know,

Jann: 47:11

And here

Joi: 47:12

toxic.

Jann: 47:13

I was so annoyed by the whole, every time you try to feel sympathy for a character, it, they led on that. They were also a piece of shit. Like I was so annoyed with James when he was telling him and like when Pete punched him in the face, I was like, good for you. Like, how dare he tell you this about your deceased wife? Like literally is not doing anything for you. It's completely selfish to tell you. And then to go on about how hard it is on him. I would've punched him in the face too. Honestly. I wouldn't have had the patience. I would've just stabbed him.

Joi: 47:44

I feel like Pete, he wasn't a bad guy until he

Jann: 47:47

nope, he was.

Joi: 47:49

Until, well, I know he was a bad guy, obviously, but I feel like he wasn't bad in the story from our perspective until he started going around Andrea some more and go like, yeah, this gonna be my

Jann: 48:00

That's what I mean. Like I feel like it did kinda lend itself to the creepy vibe, that everybody who you thought was a normal person was skeevy. Like, and I'll go all the way back to, even the girl that he killed was talking about how she was giving people fake readings and didn't care. And I was like, okay, Stevie. And like the woman who was at the convenience store, that was freaked out when she saw her in like the skeleton face. And it turns out that she shot someone in the face at point blank range and didn't care. I'm like, all right, Stevie. And then even Andrea, like she knew about the affair too. Who is this a secret from? no one is an absolute victim in all this. Whereas I, like, I do understand that like Andrea didn't, like she's still a victim in it. Like she didn't. Ask for any of this, but at the same time, like she could have left at any time. You know,

Joi: 48:52

Yeah, she

Jann: 48:53

I'm just thinking like her, if you think about her not knowing that her husband was unfaithful and trying to stay for him, and then her knowing this information and then still trying to stay, I still a little bit less bad for this person because she kind of knows that she's getting into this for someone who's kind of not worth it.

Joi: 49:12

I. To as true as it is, I hear exactly what you're saying. I don't think the best time to serve someone with divorce papers is when they're losing their mind. Like she wouldn't even tell him good news. Can you imagine bad news? Like, I'm leaving you, you

Jann: 49:29

Well, she didn't know if it was good news though, because he was cheating on her,

Joi: 49:33

Mm-hmm.

Jann: 49:34

and so the woman died like as far as she knew, he was planning on leaving her for this woman. And I'm not even saying serve him divorce papers, but that doesn't mean that like, I don't know, I was just annoyed. You know? There was like,

Joi: 49:51

how long she knew, because obviously she knew way before they had the whole breakup talk. So she knew before Pete. Um, probably, but it, it broke my heart when she was like, oh, maybe he's here to kind of like, for our anniversary. This is gonna be so nice. I would love this. And

Jann: 50:06

I think it was the same time they both saw him at the same outing. Yeah. Because remember it wasn't even a week after she was gonna confront him that Susan died.

Joi: 50:16

Yeah. I don't think it's the same outing though, because they were like giggling and shit and having a good time at the end when they were going back into it, when she saw them. Maybe it was like super close, but yeah, not at the time when they broke

Jann: 50:28

No, no. I mean, like her and Pete found out at the same

Joi: 50:31

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I see what you mean. Yeah. It was super sad though. I felt real bad for her this whole time. I can't talk shit about her at all. Yeah, like I most likely would've left too, but it was just, everything happened so quick. Like even when she's like, I'm gonna leave his ass right now, you know? And then to find out you're pregnant on top of it.

Jann: 50:58

I just don't like, it seemed like it was months after Susan died though. You know, like the whole, like him going from nightmares to him killing himself, that was very sudden. But they said like Pete was mowing his lawn after months of not doing anything. And even James said, I felt bad. I haven't seen Pete in months after this whole thing.'cause I was grieving in my own way. So she stayed with him for months and she, he was just having nightmares, it wasn't like to this point.

Joi: 51:25

that. I thought it was, she found out like Saturday and then, or whatever Pete found out and then Susan died like Sunday or Monday, you know, and then everything happened to the

Jann: 51:37

I was like a week, but I'm talking about that. That's true. Like that was like Pete found out and killed her pretty quick. He was efficient, but from the point that Susan died to the point at the beginning of this book was months and

Joi: 51:51

Oh, I didn't know that.

Jann: 51:52

he was just having like nightmares until the beginning of the book, like none of the hallucinations or anything started. So she stayed through all of that. She got pregnant during that time.

Joi: 52:03

That's crazy. I didn't think it was that. I didn't think it was that long either.'cause she was very much adamant like, I'm gonna confront him about this. I'm gonna leave him over this. but because of Susan, and then because he was losing his mind, she was like, I'm gonna hold off.

Jann: 52:18

Yeah, I feel like that was very

Joi: 52:19

sitting on it.

Jann: 52:20

For her to say. But, yeah, I feel like that was a little bit intentional, like the whole hard to follow timeline because again, it was given off that vibe of losing your mind and being someone who's losing track of time and putting yourself in James's shoes. but yeah. Yeah, I did get that. And I feel like I, the only reason that I knew that it was months is because I was super pissed that he came over there and like immediately wanted to confess after it seemed like Pete was just getting his life back together and mowing his lawn for the first time. And he had weeds growing up to like his knees and stuff, and I'm like, he's finally getting his stuff together and you're gonna come confess because you feel guilty and you're having nightmares. That's real messed up. then it turns out Pete was also a creep, so.

Joi: 53:02

I, I

53:03

read that as Pete. Just

Joi: 53:04

like he was doing it for the first time since she died, which is like a couple days maybe, and then like he's still grieving and then you go and dump this on him about his dead wife on top of it.

Jann: 53:16

Yeah. I mean, weeds don't get knee high in a couple days, but yeah, he, he had said in his like, ran like rant that it happened months.

Joi: 53:25

Yeah. That's crazy. Yeah, James was a piece of shit. They were both pieces of shit, you know, who wasn't a piece of shit. Andrea, do you wanna get into this whole thing with his dad and like his grandmother and the aunt that got killed? And that was so confusing to me. I still honestly don't really know what happened with

Jann: 53:49

I mean it is very like etched in my mind what happened and I wish I could like scrub it out. But yeah, it seemed like his mom was going through, his grandmother was going, Lillian was going through the same thing of losing her mind and her sister finally was like, listen, you gotta get it together, or I'm gonna take your kid. Which fair, like if you're going crazy, like she was going crazy. You gotta think about the kids. And she pretty much said like, okay, I'm gonna come get him. He is. And I feel like she was playing it cool because she didn't think Jimmy was gonna go. And then immediately when he started to stand up, she like lost her shit and BD, her sister's head in and insane, complete

Joi: 54:32

also, she was sexually abusing the father too. Jim. Jimmy, right?

Jann: 54:38

think when did, where'd you get that?

Joi: 54:40

With the whole notches in the bed.

Jann: 54:45

I don't think it was abuse necessarily. I felt like, I mean, it is abuse, don't get me wrong. It is definitely abuse. But, um, I don't think, when I say I don't think it's abuse, I don't think she was actually touching him, but I don't think she under, I think she thought he was getting off on her when in reality he was going crazy himself and thought it was his aunt. Which again is creepy. That whole dynamic is just weird. Um, and no, I don't wanna get into it

Joi: 55:17

Okay.

Jann: 55:19

after we already got into it. I don't wanna talk about it.

Joi: 55:23

And the whole thing was like the whole ancestry of this is their land. And everyone went crazy.

Jann: 55:28

That's why I don't really understand why the sister wasn't victim to this.

Joi: 55:34

Like it was just like one outta every generation or I don't get it.

Jann: 55:39

they kind of talked about how it has something to do with the house and how Lillian decided to move back to that house and that's when she started to go crazy. but James went crazy without ever being in that house.

Joi: 55:53

Didn't he go to the house at the very beginning when they talked about how the grandmother died in the first place and the boos, like they came and cleaned it up, closed it, and then left again. And that's when he changed his name and everything and just like, you don't have to come back, but something calls them back to that property, to that land. And that's why they always come back and that's why they always end up going insane and killing themselves. And that's what she said at the end too. She was like, your daughter, she's gonna find this house and she's gonna clean it up and it's gonna look great. And then she's gonna start slowly losing her mind till she dies too.

Jann: 56:29

Well, I'm just thinking about who those relatives could be, because they did say that at the beginning of the book. They went to the funeral just because they felt like it was the right thing to do. but that couldn't have been James. Right? That couldn't have been like,'cause he lived there. They made it seem like the person who inherited the house didn't know anything about it. I guess he could have been acting like he didn't know anything about it, even though he grew up there.

Joi: 56:52

Yeah, he acted like he didn't know about it.'cause remember he changed his name, his last name and when he wanted show his son James, the picture of the grandmother.'cause it had the name Boone on it and he didn't want him to know about that.

Jann: 57:05

oh. Okay. Well there you go.

Joi: 57:10

Yeah. Good

Jann: 57:12

So anyway, I heard that you said you were gonna rate it a three. Um, is that just scary factor or are you changing your rating from a four to a

Joi: 57:19

I dunno. Scary factor for my kind of scary, this got me at like a three. It got me a little paranoid about being in the dark, but I wasn't gonna like sleep. The lights on,

Jann: 57:32

Okay. Weirdo. So, anything else you wanna bring up or can we consider this one a close?

Joi: 57:39

The epilogue. Annoyed the hell outta me a little bit. It was just like, I wanted something bad to happen to Pete at the end. But I guess like if it's just a mental health crisis that James went through, and that's just like a family kind of curse, pretty much just mental health. Um, it kind of makes sense that nothing bad really happens to him. I wanted like the police to find out that he killed Susan or something, but nothing really came of it,'cause they never really looked back into Susan's death like he said they would, and that's what

Jann: 58:08

One thing I didn't get about,

Joi: 58:11

Hmm.

Jann: 58:11

yeah. One thing I didn't get about Pete, because as much as I don't agree with him, I can understand his motivation for wanting to screw people over that screwed him over. he killed Susan and said, I don't know why she would ever believe that I would raise this bastard child, or like someone else's kid, and then he's gonna end up raising his kid anyway.

Joi: 58:28

Out of revenge. That's different. I'm not gonna be played. I'm be the player. It doesn't make sense because it's an idiot. What did you think of Susan? She was just kind of there, just like she died at the beginning. She was just a cheater. That's pretty much it.

Jann: 58:44

yeah, don't care.

Joi: 58:48

I'm trying to like draw it out so I can remember at this point I was gonna make, but I don't remember something about Pete and it just drove me crazy.

Jann: 58:58

Was it that he was so insecure?

Joi: 59:00

Obviously he was insecure. It was, it was just, remember what I was gonna say. So when James found out, while he was hanging, while he was dying, he was thinking about, it's like that Pete killed Susan. Like he had to be him. Like I didn't kill her, right.

Jann: 59:19

Mm-hmm.

Joi: 59:20

he was like, well I do deserve this anyway.'cause I did take a life anyway. I killed Camilla.

Jann: 59:24

Right.

Joi: 59:25

Um, I feel like even though he was very selfish and very like me, me, me, me, me as he was going down the spiral too, I feel like he could've been a forgivable character if he got help and if he didn't kill Camilla, you know what I mean? Like, I feel like he could've easily like turned that around and been like a better character and been

Jann: 59:46

feel like he would've been redeemable if he had just gotten help. Like I, I'm not saying like I wish he hadn't killed Camilla, but if he was out of his right mind, then I don't think that's necessarily something you can blame someone for. Like he was literally losing his mind. It's not like he was Yeah. So I feel like he could've been redeemable. Sure. Um, my whole thing is I thought the curse was going to end because he didn't take his own life technically. Like Pete picked him up and then dropped him again. So it was kind of like a murder. So I thought that might like break the family curse, but nah.

Joi: 1:00:21

I. I don't know. Like I was really hoping that he, that Pete would help him get down, but take him into like, um, an an asylum or something because he did kill Camilla at the very least. And then he was gonna blame killing Susan on him too. So then he could watch him raise his daughter. Well, that's why I'm saying like, I thought it would come out, or like he would confess to it once he got the help. Once he was saved from the house, I thought they're gonna like the, would be them take like him visiting. Pete, Andrea and the baby like older. Obviously visiting James in asylum'cause criminally insane'cause he killed someone and he can watch Pete raise his daughter. I thought that would be more of a revenge than you just dying. Me taking care of you.'cause I also think that you'll become a ghost and haunt the shit out of me. You know? I mean, I'd rather, I think the revenge would be better if you're living and I'm living the life that you would probably want to have with your

Jann: 1:01:21

I mean, if you think about it, like, I don't think that argument makes sense because from Pete's point of view, he didn't know that he killed Camilla. And he also didn't really open up the murder of his wife again because it would've pointed to him. So it would've just been him saving him and then him getting help and like he wouldn't be sleeping with his wife, which was his goal. So yeah, I, I think Pete's motivation and his actions kind of lined up for me. what I will point out too is that I felt like he was selfish until the very end. Like the point that the fact that he said he's not gonna leave a note because he didn't know what to say to them, um, you could have at least confessed to like killing Camilla, like give her family some, like

Joi: 1:02:03

Mm-hmm.

Jann: 1:02:04

why

Joi: 1:02:05

But that goes very much to the,

Jann: 1:02:07

No one knows he did that except him,

Joi: 1:02:09

because yeah, he did say he is like, I don't want like my daughter.'cause at that point he knew, um, Andrea was pregnant from the ghost or whatever. Um, that to have the same mystery in the same like, issue of trying decode some kind of message. Like why would you have to be something decoded, like tell her like, this is an illness and that you're probably going to deal with it too. Stay far away from this place. Don't ever come here. Who says it has to be short and sweet and to the point, like, you know what I mean? Make it a book. Like

Jann: 1:02:36

Say, look, listen, stay in therapy your entire life and never come to this place. Done.

Joi: 1:02:42

Yeah.

Jann: 1:02:43

And also, I killed this person, sorry,

Joi: 1:02:46

Right. Don't look, don't listen to the visions. Don't, don't look into our photo albums, don't look into our family. It's cursed. Don't do it. You know, it could have been a million different ways to

Jann: 1:02:57

even to his daughter, like just write it out to his wife even. Like, Hey, this is what was happening if you wanna save our daughter. And the fact that he knew that she was pregnant. Um,

Joi: 1:03:08

and

Jann: 1:03:09

been the convincing points. No, it just could have been the convincing point. Like I never told him. If he knows, then this must be true, you know? So I'm gonna keep my daughter away from this place. Simple.

Joi: 1:03:20

And on top of that too, it is just like it, it gave me kind of creepy feelings too. He was like, well, I don't, I don't really wanna do this. And Nico was like, but you came here to do it, so you're gonna deal it. You know? I was like, well dang. Like that's like super. That gave me the creeps too, you know, when she like, I kind of let'em, and then like the aunt was like, there's nothing I can do. Like I tried and there's nothing I can do. She's more powerful than me. Like, geez. Now I was hoping that like if we go with the whole metaphor of him being like, just like the personifying, the mental illness, illness itself, and just seeing the two sides fight, that was really sad because when you think about it, when you have a mental illness, like your brain is fighting itself, so you could see like to the very end, like he was trying to fight it and he lost. Yeah.

Jann: 1:04:08

I thought the aunt had disappeared to like, help them find James. Like,'cause they said, like the wife said, like, that light just came on and it was not on when we pulled up. I thought that was the aunt. Um, but yeah, I guess not.

Joi: 1:04:23

Like I said, we're, we're very much like we talk about like how these authors could have done this or should have been written that way, you know what I mean? But I'm sure like, not to say they shouldn't be proud of their work or anything, but you know, people's minds work differently. People are satisfied in different ways. Like

Jann: 1:04:38

Oh

Joi: 1:04:39

obviously a lot of

Jann: 1:04:39

it would've been.

Joi: 1:04:41

but you know, it's just different ways it could've went.

Jann: 1:04:43

Yeah, definitely not saying it would've been better or worse. That was just a prediction that I had that didn't pan out. I like doing that actually, like, just saying like, this is what I thought would happen and I was completely wrong because I feel like I get like arrogant almost with like predicting the ending of things. So when I'm actually surprised, I'm like, nice. Nicely done.

Joi: 1:05:03

If it's nicely done, if it's like, there's been times where I try to predict like the end of like other horror, um, books and they don't pan out that way, but they're also a bad ending. I'm like, this is your job, do better.

Jann: 1:05:18

Do better. Yeah.

Joi: 1:05:21

But yeah, I, I think overall I still gonna stick with the four. just to have one of those books where it's this is a good like fall kind of spooky book to read when you're just bored a few years down the road.

Jann: 1:05:33

So I was considering upping it to one and a half stars, but I'm not gonna do that. And this is why. I feel like while the writing like did was impressive in the fact that she like set a mood without actually saying much as far as dissenting into insanity. I also feel like I'm taking a half a star away because it had unnecessary like uncomfortable sexual incestuous scenes and that's not my thing. So I feel like I should take a whole star away. If I can do half a star rating, I'm gonna do half a star.

Joi: 1:06:06

I gotta say the whole sex scenes and the, I, it wasn't my cup of tea. Not those kind of sex scenes, love, sex scenes, but those kind of sex scenes, it, I wasn't feeling it.

Jann: 1:06:18

This is not where I wanted them to manifest.

Joi: 1:06:21

It was, it was one of those things where it's like they're using sex as like a, a like a, almost like a perverted kind of like, what do you call the show where it's like, you're killing people but you're getting off on it. It is like that kind of thing. Like I, I wasn't enjoying that. Yeah. It was like a snuff kind of'cause he was killing people too sometimes. Or it was like blood involved and Yeah. Or was incest involved, all those things.

Jann: 1:06:43

It

Joi: 1:06:44

No, it was the opposite of Turning Moore. I turned into a desert,

Jann: 1:06:51

All right. And with that, I think we can call this one rat. All right. So, um, we want your guys' discussion like in your voices and when we talk about these books. So let us know what you feel about Crescendo, if you've read it or any other book that you've read. Um, joy, where can they talk to us?

Joi: 1:07:14

One more thing about Crescendo. When you just said the title, I looked it up and I was like, I know Crescendo. Right? That's like the peak or the summit or the climax like this. All that's a perfect title for this book is everything leads to a Head and it just explodes and then he dies. You know what I mean? And also all the sexing. You can find us at Black Girl Reads Podcast. The blackest spelled BK on TikTok Twitter. Well, on Twitter is Black Girl Reads Pod because podcast was too long for the username. Go figure. But yeah, us out. Um, reach out and follow us.

Jann: 1:08:02

Okay. We're gonna work on that. Uh, but let's go ahead and announce the, next book, which is a mystery, which is way more at my speed. So it is called Monday's Not Coming by Tiffany D. Jackson. so the synopsis, here we go. Monday, Charles is missing and only Claudia seems to notice. Claudia and Monday have always been inseparable more sisters than friends. So when Monday doesn't turn up for the first day of school, Claudia's worried. When she doesn't sew for the second day of school or the second week, Claudia knows that something is wrong Monday wouldn't just leave her to endure tests and bullies alone, not after last year's rumors, and not with her grades on the line. Now Claudia needs her best and only friend more than ever. But Monday's mother refuses to give Claudia a straight answer. And Monday's sister April is even less help. As Claudia digs deeper into her friend's disappearance, she discovers that no one seems to remember the last time they saw Monday. How can a teenage girl just vanish without anyone noticing that she's gone? That's it. That's the whole, that's the whole synopsis. I have never read a Tiffany D. Jackson book, but she has a lot of books on our list. She seems very prolific, so I'm excited to get into it.

Joi: 1:09:22

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I'm excited to talk about it. I, I'm ahead. I read it already, so I can't wait to talk about it.

Jann: 1:09:30

I did too, but again, I've told you this more than once and I'm going to put you out there now because you did it again. You could not talk about the book before. Book

Joi: 1:09:41

talk about it. I'm excited to talk about it. Read it already.

Jann: 1:09:46

wasn't necessary. Alright. Joy is continuously breaking the book club rules no matter how often I tell her not to. So, So Joy might be a temporary character on this podcast, just so y'all know.